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TheKingaSwing Profile
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Registered: 09-2004
Location: Midlands, England
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Re: Silocone/Fiberglass Molds, a question:


One of the reasons I chose the 89 cowl was because of the organic look too it. It cant be messy but it doesnt have to be quite as clean as the others, which really do require a body shop cowl to get them perfect.

Vacuuming silicone was something I read just yeaterday before seeing Jays post. Its not something I had come across yet and will research.

Looking in a mirror or taking photos does make a world of difference. Im always amazed how different mine looks in photos or even in the digital window on the camera. Your mind can make you see things in ways you want to as opposed to whats really there.

Thanks for the tip on the primer. The clay I have does get very soft but only when Ive warmed it and worked it. Otherwise I could kill someone with a cold block ! HAHA

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Check out our stuff at http://www.instagram.com/TigerStoneFX or https://www.facebook.com/TigerStoneFX !
7/15/2009, 9:45 am Link to this post Send Email to TheKingaSwing   Send PM to TheKingaSwing Yahoo
 
Daft Vader Profile
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Registered: 06-2005
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Re: Silocone/Fiberglass Molds, a question:


thats really good for water based clay, let it dry out alittle and it will firm up enough to really get in tight with the detail.

once you are finished and completly happy with the sculpt, spray it with clear laquer, any brand of car laquer will do, you can even used black paint if you want to see what it looks like black. doing this will seal the clay and give it a thin protective film.
one this to note tho, is you want a matt finish for your cowl, after you have sprayed it with laquer, spray it again with a matt paint as silicone is that good, it will reproduce the gloss finish caused from the laquer.

I wouldnt worry too much about de gasing the silicne if you are doing a brush on mold, I would only degass the silicne if i were making a matrix mold or block mould,for this, your brush will pop any bubble if you do it carefully.

Id do a couple of thin coats just to catch all the surface detail, then id thicken up the silicone with either a thixtropic agent or cabosil and butter 2 thick coats on, you have to be carefull not the trap any air bubbles so be carefull.
Once its cured, you can either paint on another unthickend coat of silicone as this will smooth out some of the rough surface caused by the thicker silicone or you can mix up some dish soap and water, dip a clear brush in and paint it over the surface of the thickend silicone whilst its still "wet" the dish soap wth lubricate the brush enough to allow you to smooth over the rought surface.

either way, when your silicone is cured, use your water based clay to make a dividing wall, make it as neat as you can, cut some keys into it and seal it with plenty of clear laquer, spray a couple of coats of release agent over the wall and begin glassing, once cured, remove the clay wall, clean it up, add more release and glass the other half.

once thats done, drill some location holes in teh flange so the mold will bolt back together, carfull separate the 2 halfs, clean up and your done.
7/15/2009, 10:04 am Link to this post Send Email to Daft Vader   Send PM to Daft Vader
 
Infrno Profile
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Registered: 08-2008
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Re: Silocone/Fiberglass Molds, a question:


I am going to be moving this over to the "How did they do that" section. This is a great thread with a lot of helpful advice. I'll leave it here for a couple days, so everyone can read this.

PS: I am a big fan of Rebound25.

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Check Out this Forum: THE CAVE
7/15/2009, 10:33 am Link to this post Send Email to Infrno   Send PM to Infrno
 
Mr Justin Profile
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Registered: 04-2008
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Re: Silocone/Fiberglass Molds, a question:


Thank you guys soo much. This has been extremely helpful for me.

I had no idea that the silicone would actually be able to pick up a gloss finish vs. a matte finish?! That is incredible, but also a mistake I would've definitely made had you not told me.

I'll keep you all posted with pics and info. Thanks again!

Jeff - I checked out that Rebound 25; that is nice stuff. I think that's the way I'm gonna go for the silicone.

Almost forgot, about how much silicone do you typically need to do a 4-5 layer silicone mold for a cowl? A whole gallon?

Last edited by Mr Justin, 7/15/2009, 1:42 pm


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Mexicanbat Profile
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Registered: 02-2004
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Re: Silocone/Fiberglass Molds, a question:


try this video

mold making


split silicon mold video


the last one i think


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The Real Mexicanbat
7/15/2009, 8:09 pm Link to this post Send Email to Mexicanbat   Send PM to Mexicanbat MSN Yahoo
 
resinsamurai Profile
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Registered: 01-2009
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Re: Silocone/Fiberglass Molds, a question:


the secret technique to using soft clay for very fine detail
is to stick the sculpt in the fridge or freezer as needed to firm the clay up

if the piece is big, then you take a can of air (usually used for cleaning computers of dust) turn it upside down and spray the clay and it freezes it

now the clay is really firm and you can treat it like hard clay for a minute or two

degassing silicone also gives you a better mix of the silicone and catalyst, just as a secondary benefit

the diluted dish soap release works well, has some positives and a few negatives, best one I have found is taking paste wax and dissolve it in 100% iso alcohol and then spray it thru an airbrush. If you use a cheap 10.00 airbrush that just runs air over a bottle with a nozzle it works great and it doesn't clog the guts of the airbrush. Nother secret right there. Have one top quality airbrush for paint work, and one cheap one for the grunt work.

The best part of that first video is they tint each layer of silicone a different color. When your new to mold making, say the first year then you have a hard time telling the thickness of the silicone. Color differences help you learn when things are even. And its really easy. Two silicone pigment colors are all you need.

But, I would never suggest a plaster bandage shell unless your budget only allows for it. Plaster will not hold up over time and then your mold will be able to warp. THATS BAD


Yes fiberglassing sucks but its a staple for a reason
you can also use urethane resin and glass matte if you aren't casting resin in the mold.

Another secret" use the thinnest glass matte you can.
Yes you might have to do extra layers but you get a better jacket because it takes less resin to soak the matte, and thinner resin means faster cure.

Better, Cleaner, Easier, Faster.

WORK SMARTER NOT HARDER


For a cowl, you can usually get away with 1.5 quarts for a proper skin thickness. An entire gallon will work when your molding a full life cast sculpture



TIM SALE COWL!! Right on, I have been working on one inspired by that for a very long time. But never bothered to dedicate the time to it. But, remember that the Begins and TDK cowls were based off the Sale artwork.

Working on a Michael Turner movie style cowl currently.

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And what’s ten years? Well, it’s roughly how long it takes to put in ten thousand hours of hard practice. Ten thousand hours is the magic number of greatness.
7/15/2009, 9:13 pm Link to this post Send Email to resinsamurai   Send PM to resinsamurai
 
Mr Justin Profile
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Registered: 04-2008
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Re: Silocone/Fiberglass Molds, a question:


Hector, thanks for those vids!

Resinsamurai - I'm definetly gonna go with the fiberglass for the jacket. I've worked with the plaster material and it's not a whole lot of fun. Really heavy and just not my favorite material (Chips and deteriorates easily I've noticed). Yeah, I CAN NOT WAIT to start a Tim Sale cowl. I love the artwork, and I know trying to sculpt that cowl for someone to wear in real life is going to be pretty difficult I bet; but it's my favorite cowl so I'll give it a shot.

Here's a small update on the sculpt from today...Getting there...

Image

Image

Last edited by Mr Justin, 7/15/2009, 10:12 pm


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Mexicanbat Profile
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Re: Silocone/Fiberglass Molds, a question:


your welcome bro
and kip up the good job

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The Real Mexicanbat
7/16/2009, 3:09 pm Link to this post Send Email to Mexicanbat   Send PM to Mexicanbat MSN Yahoo
 
RevolutionImages Profile
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Registered: 08-2008
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Re: Silocone/Fiberglass Molds, a question:


Ive Used Rebound 25. on 3 occasions now. and for a cowl (with neck) i was able to get a 4-5 layer mold with just the trial size unit. don't buy a whole gallon of rebound. you might be disappointed. not to mention the $. but actually i think the smooth-on gallon unit of Rebound 25 is actually is a gallon of A and a gallon of B. which makes 2 total. maybe thats why the $ bump.

Personally i hate Rebound now, it was the first silicone i ever tried for mold making (besides silicone caulking) and i thought, well its better than the tin cure for sure , and in certain aspects it really is. but for cure inhibition and ease of use it sucks the big one. even a thin coat results in the silicone running off the vertical surface forming drips and problems. this is after using mold max stroke 30. The Rebound cured fine when i sealed with Acrylic clear. but once i made my hard copy and tried various spray paint finished. only one can out of 3 did not react with the Rebound. albeit i only tried Krylon and American Accents. not Rustoleum. so even then i had areas where the rebound didn't cure. later to find also it doesn't like Chavant NSP. which techincally should be fine, maybe i contaminated my clay. i don't know.

Now, i only generated this hate after buying a gallon unit of Mold Max Stroke 30. and realizing how easy it is to use, and how it stays put where you brush it. i can even thin it, where as Rebound was already to runny and did not "self-thicken". but Stroke sure did. And knowing that cure-inhibition is a worry of the past. i am very pleased. here's a tip: Stroke can be tinted with regular ol' Artist Oil Paint. just a trace amount will color the new batch, which helps distinguish layers. Rebound seemed to have a different hue when cured which made tinting unnecessary. hope this helps some. this is my experience though. if someone can help me, or tell me something that can help me decide to try rebound again. im all game. like what paints will not cause cure inhibition, etc.

edited because i sound like chinaman with my poor punctuation and incomplete sentences. I don't know why i type like that. lol

Last edited by RevolutionImages, 7/20/2009, 3:50 am
7/20/2009, 3:43 am Link to this post Send PM to RevolutionImages
 
Mr Justin Profile
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Registered: 04-2008
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Re: Silocone/Fiberglass Molds, a question:


Thanks Forest. That's good to know about the amount that I'd need. I was hoping a trial size or two would be enough.

So the silicone wouldn't cure on certain spots of the master you made because of the type of paint you used? I wonder why though. I'm planning on making a master as well eventually. I'll definitely have to look into this some more. Thanks Forest!

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